Live vs Dead

Discussion in 'Ball Pythons' started by rxysnoboard, Mar 30, 2006.

  1. rxysnoboard

    rxysnoboard Embryo

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    16
    I feed my baby ball live mice... is this ok?? i tried feeding her dead but she dosent like it... she goes ape for live mice though... and i ALWAYS watch her until the mouse is forsure dead...
     
  2. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  3. Skunky

    Skunky Well-Known Member

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    If you're feeding responsibly, and paying close attention the whole process, there's nothing wrong with feeding live.

    Of course, I'm sure plenty of folk will weigh in on their thoughts pleading the case of feeding prekilled :lol:

    In the great words of the Shrapster..there is no right or wrong answer, just what works for you and your snake. Too true.

    End of the day, it being responsible in what you do that's the key.
     
  4. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  5. PythonPreacher

    PythonPreacher New Member

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    Of course we all know that feeding f/t or prekilled mice is prefered but sometimes it just doesn't work. I also have a ball python that refuses to eat anything that is not alive when offered. Some suggest that if you feed live followed by a dead chaser you can switch them over. I have tried this without much luck. Feeding live certainly has its cons. Just make sure that you never leave on in there over night or something like that.
     
  6. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  7. reptiles4me

    reptiles4me New Member

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    I feed live as well and agree with everything that's been said. It's the people that just throw a live rat in the tank and then go grab a beer that usually end up with issues. And the dead chaser trick didn't work for me either pythonpreacher. After about 2 months of trying to switch, I finally gave up after I came to the realization that not eating was probably much more stressful to him than feeding live.
     
  8. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  9. shrap

    shrap ReptileBoards Addict

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    PythonPreacher,

    Your sig is too big. You are only allowed 3 lines of text. You currently have 8. You have been notified twice via PM about this and have still not fixed it. Please do so or we will have to delete your sig completely.
     
  10. JEFFREH

    JEFFREH Administrator

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  11. CornyGuy

    CornyGuy Well-Known Member

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    I go with f/t of course, for the main reason of making sure he can't fight back. But also because it is just easier. Live mice you have to go buy everytime you feed your snake. With f/t you just pull them out of the freezer, and thaw them out.
     
  12. babybub

    babybub Member

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    289
    I would like to feed mine f/t but sometimes he just wont eat...and i know my baby likes to eat...lolz he is such a porker..he hasnt refused a meal yet (live) although i did have that scare when he decided he wanted a friend....
     
  13. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    1,181
    I feel very strongly that frozen is the better option, but I completely understand that some snakes just won't accept that. To me, it seems like there are potentially several dangers with feeding live (parasites from the mice/rats, bites, etc...) that aren't there with the frozen, and if it's at all possible, there's no reason to put your snake through these things. I've met quite a few people that view feeding live as the way it should be done because that's the way they eat in the wild. They also think that the bites and things are just part of a snakes life. It's very sad to see their snakes covered with scars when you know that can be easily avoided.

    Ball pythons are one of the worst in my experience for switching to frozen, they are just so stubborn. So as much as I don't like live, there are just times it has to be done and as long as you watch carefully and are responsible about it, it shouldn't lead to any problems with your snake.

    Another possible option, if it doesn't bother you too much, is to knock the mouse/rat on the head a little so it's still walking around but not all there. Then it wouldn't fight back as much and the chances of injury to your snake is that much more reduced.
     
  14. diablo17

    diablo17 Member

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    382
    i agree with what's been said. responsible live-feeding is fine, but P/K is better cua there is always some risk to feeding live. but if you really prefer live or have a BP like mine who won't eat it if he didn't keill it, go ahead with live.

    RE: the dead chaser... it worked for me... ONCE! after that one time he wouldn't take the chaser anymore.
     
  15. gunslinger

    gunslinger Embryo

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    18
    the only luck I have ever had with switching over from live to F/T is when my bp's go on the Jenny Craig Diet in the winter. Usually if they have gone for a couple of months without feed it is easier to coax them into accepting F/T.

    However, as it typical with everyting I have learned when it comes to my balls, they are usually the ones making all the decisions - lol.
     
  16. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    alright, I have a new story for you guys on this subject...

    as I stated above I am completely for the frozen method as long as it works, but I know there are some snakes that just won't take it. I then said that as long as you feed responsibly when you have to feed live, that I couldn't see any problem with that...

    yesterday at work, I had to feed our four ball pythons that have absolutely refused going to frozen. This is the fourth week of feeding them live and although there haven't been any problems in the first three weeks, there certainly was this time (i'm very good about watching the whole time no matter what to make sure nothing goes wrong. I'll be the first one to stick my hand in there if something doesn't look right). The third ball that ate yesterday struck the mouse in the center of his body, which happens often, and coiled around him. As soon as the snake coiled the mouse bit the side of the snakes head pretty bad. I saw the blood immediately and had to hold the mouses head and teeth away from the snake while the snake was killing it. It didn't seem to bother the snake too much because he just went on his way and ate the mouse immediately after killing it. I cleaned up his head the best I could after that and we started putting neosporin on it.

    I know this wasn't a real bad bite, but even when you are sure you are doing everything right, things can go wrong. It killed me yesterday knowing that a snake was bit by a prey item while I was feeding him. That's never happened to me before and I'm worried about in the future stopping this from happening again. I don't know what other precautions I can take... just keep in mind, there is just always a possibility of danger for your animal with live food...
     
  17. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    please let me know if this has happened to anyone else. I really try to do everything I can to make sure the snakes never get hurt and I feel like I couldn't control this. it sure would make me feel better if I know someone else has had this problem...

    and if you did, how did you prevent it from happening again...?
     
  18. diablo17

    diablo17 Member

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    382
    that happened to me once. i was lucky and the mouse didn't manage to break the skin with his bite.

    it tried stunned mice after that, but he won't go near it if it isn't walking around. even if it's laying there twitching around he ignores it, so i had to keep just tossing them in live. however, my snake actually seems to have solved the problem on his own. since the incident he has consistently struck the mice on or near the head, which keeps him from getting bit. but i still stand by ready to stick my hand in and do what i have to do in case of any trouble.
     
  19. shrap

    shrap ReptileBoards Addict

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    Adult mice are mean little boogers. I wont feed them. Try feeding small weanling rats. The ones that are about 3 weeks old. They are still babies and are not aggressive. I never fed anything larger than a small rat... 6 week old rat. They are still in deer in the head lights mode and I rarely have any issues with bites.... less than 5 in 1000's of live feedings.
     
  20. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    the problem is that I work at terrible pet store and I had to pull all the strings I could to feed them live adult mice. weanling or baby rats are not an option. if it was up to them, when they repeatedly turned down the frozen, the snakes would have starved to death and would have either learned to take frozen or just die. I have to almost sneak around to feed them live. I'm honestly embarassed to be working there but I figure if I leave, then no one will take care of the reptiles. It's just not something they see as important and none of the other employees will do much of anything for them. It's really sad.

    and working there I hear all kinds of horror stories about how people care for their animals and it kills me, but if I'm not there to try to convince them they need to change some things (which it does work occasionally), then they would all be tortured. And I straight out refuse to sell things to people I don't think will take proper care of them or refuse to buy the proper equipment (right size cage, lighting, etc..). I am proud to admit that I have been threatened with my job on multiple occasions for "fighting the system". For example, I raise complete hell when they put mealworms in with the 5 and 6" beardies and the newborn leopard geckos, but it's the only way I can sleep at night (by the way, it took a month, but I did win that battle. we no longer have to put mealworms in those cages).

    I'm scared to say what petstore I work with, because it's certainly one that everyone knows and it's going to cause a lot of discussion if people really knew the truth about how things work there...
     
  21. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    no one that's in charge in either my store or upper management, has very much hands-on experience with reptiles and they are the ones that make all the rules of how things have to be done. It is so stupid how much money and sales they lose because they just won't do things right.

    not to mention all the animals we lose... it's like a dang concentration camp!
     
  22. Blake_Herman

    Blake_Herman Well-Known Member

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    1,181
    last night, I had a customer come in that was keeping a midsized red-eared slider in a tupperware full of rocks and sand... that's it. he was buying a waterbowl, but it was the smallest one we sell and no where near big enough for his turtle to even sit in. He didn't have any UV lights and no heat of any kind. He's had it for a year and thinks he is doing a wonderful job caring for it. I thought I had talked him into at least a purchase of a heat lamp, but after he left it was all back on the shelf... :D

    the only good thing was that hopefully he will switch the setup. He said he had an empty 10 gallon and I told him that would be a million times better than a plastic bowl. I told him the best way to set it up without spending any more money (he refused to spend any money at all on it other than for the waterbowl). I'm hoping he will see how much his turtle is suffering and he eventually does something about it. My job sucks.
     
  23. diablo17

    diablo17 Member

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    382
    it's repulsive how people refuse to take care of thier animals properly. just because the animals can't say "hey, i'm dying here!" people think they're doing fine.

    so tell me, which is it... petco or petsmart? they both suck, so nobody will be suprised in the least.

    hey shrap, where can you get those tiny rats? my local stores seem to only have medium to large rats and they're way too big. but i want to switch for safety reasons and because rats are more nutritious.
     
  24. shrap

    shrap ReptileBoards Addict

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    We already know how things work there. Many of us have had our battles with management of these pet stores over proper care and husbandry.

    That is why a good percentage of long time herpers dont buy ANYTHING from pet stores. They dont deserve my business. If a private breeder did things the way most pet stores did they would be crucified and would have no future in this business.
     
  25. shrap

    shrap ReptileBoards Addict

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    You feed live, PK or FT?
     

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