Ok, I posted this as part of a post that a few people have commented on. But I wanted it as a seperate topic as I was interested in what Corn snake keepers have to say on this. I was browsing sites for a basic Corn Snake setup and on one site at the bottom of the product page it said this So.... how can you tell if your corn snake is stressed due to the enclosure being too big? So if you provide enough cover from the warm side to the cool side surely it will feel safe? Mick
in all honesty i think that the whole it will get stressed out thig is a load of crap. as long as you have enough secure and tight hides the animal should be fine, the more space the better. if they got stressed from having alot of room then there would be no snakes in the wild. with our corn we got him at 6 weeks and put him right into a 20gal and had plenty of places for him to hide in. he started eating right away and never seemed to have any issues same with my ball, she was just under a year when i got her and put her straight into a 40gal with plenty of hides and she has never missed a meal. to me its like putting a betta in a tiny cup vs a large tank. so many people believe they will get stressed if they have alot of room but what they dont realize is that these animals enjoy having alot of room as long as they have a snug little hide to go to when they want to feel safe. and i know its not a snake but one member that used to post in the leo forum had their leo in a 90gal tank and didnt seem to have any issues. i just dont think that you can ever have too much room. also when ellie grows up ill probably get her a much larger tank, her 40gal bin is seeming too small for her and she isnt even 3 ft yet. but then again ellie likes to stretch out and lounge about in plain sight
I agree. I think the stress issue is a function of not having proper hiding places in whatever sized enclosure you use. Does the animal need a 100 gal tank? No. Will it live perfectly well in one? Yes, IF you put about as many places to hide as it would in the wild over that space. I am not suggesting a 100 gal tank. My point is the snake doesn't know floorspace. It only knows security. Provide that, and proper heating, in any size viv and the snake should be happy. Good luck. Jeff
i dont know, but will too much space causing snakes harder finding it's food? and if you gives them life feeder they might hide in place your snake cant reach.. just my opinion tho..
well true that if you have a small snake in a huge enclosure and put in a small mouse and just let them go at it it would be harder to find food. i would hope though that no snake owner would just sit back and not try to help out their snake at all unless they are doing a study or something. i dont have that issue though because i never use live feeders and most of my snakes are fed in another enclosure. plus i always dangle food in front of all my herps so they never have to go looking for their dinner
Well this is interesting, this will probably influence my decision about what enclosure to get for my Corn when I eventually get it. 20g? Round about 20" x 12" x 12", so that would seem like a good size for a hatchling, but it seems quite small for an adult, I mean I know the snake would actually fit in there, just doesn't seem as though there would be enough room to move, so would you upgrade to a larger viv/tank once it gets to adult size? Say to a 40g, 48" x 13" x 16". If I got a faun, the substrate would be paper towel, so no risk of eating the substrate, so I wouldn't need a seperate enclosure for feeding, unless there is another reason for doing this. If I kept it in a viv/tank I don't know what substrate I would use, I was thinking of the carpet tiles I recently got for my Leo, but then the snake wouldn't have anywhere to burrow. But in either case I wouldn't give it live feeders, too much risk of the snake getting damaged, and I would probably leave the food in there to see if the snake can find it, to try and keep the snakes natural instinct to hunt in place, if it didn't or couldn't find it then I would assist. Ellie? Which of your herps is Ellie? I was thinking of calling my Leo Elle (no i) if she indeed turns out to be a she, looks like I will have to call her Cherry instead, my second choice.
ellie is my ball puython, my favorite of all my snakes and the most dimwitted animals you will ever see lol but i love her for it. she is the one that used to live right beside my rats until i moves her to a bin because for the life of me i cant keep up the proper humidity in a normal tank some snake keepers say that feeding your snake in another enclosure reduces the risk of you being bitten. the only time ive ever been nipped was because i fed ellie in another enclosure. but i feed my other 2 snakes in different enclosures because i think it helpps get them used to being handled, at least before the meal. with all my reptiles i feed them right after being held so they will think that good things follow being held and tolorate it a bit more. my eastern milk eats in anothr enclosure because he gets distracted easily, so he has to go into a tuny tuppuware container and be in the dark for a few hours with his dinner. i think that we will also move our corn to a bigger tank when he grows up. the breeder said that a 20gal would be fine but i just cant picture him being that tightly packed, plus he is so active i think it would be cruel.
Surely you would have to control the hmidity in the bin as well? And a Ball Python in a bin, wouldn't it get cramped in there? The feeding in a seperate enclosure is a good idea to get the snake used to being handled, certainly plausable. I think I will still go for a faun, the one I am after is only £15, I have room for that, and it will give me time to move some furniture round or get rid of it in preperation for a viv.
the bin is the size of a 40gal and it has a closed top and is much much much easier to keep the humidity up in, i decide how much air flow it gets. before with the tank i would have to soak everything once or twice a day. pluss if the substrate isnt all wet ellie's belly scales get irritated, she has sensative skin for some reason or another.
Being new to rep keeping it just seemed weird you keeping her in a bin, lol. It is a rubbish bin right?Is it clear or opaque?
i thought it was weird when i first heard about it but after trying it i think its a life saver. ellie has been so much more active and happy seemign since we changed. and its just a large clear blastic storage bin i got from walmart. it was the largest size they had while i was there. i also keep my hermit crabs in bins for the same reasons, also buying a 40gal bin is alot cheaper than buying a 40gal tank. some of my crabs were getting into fights so i put my 3 big ones in a 40gal bin and my 4 smaller ones in a 20-30gal sized bin
Ar right, storage bin, lol, I just had visions of this big black rubbish bin with recycled "waste only" wrote on it, lmao. Yeah when I was down Focus, a DIY store in my town they have alot of those, I didn't really pay attention to them, but I was after building a playground for my Gerbils, just to give them a break from the Gerbilarium, and I thought the storage bins would be great if they are big enough. Need to go and have another look.
if i ever get pet mice im using a bin for their cage, they cant get out of small holes like alot of normal bar cages
I think we're going off topic here, lol, oh well it was my topic anyway. My bars of my cage topper for my Gerbilarium are small enough for them not to get out but large anough for them not to damage their noses if they chew them. They don't seem to have any other issues. Back on topic - I think I will go for a faun, then a month or so after invest in a viv, and that will give me time to prep it for when the Corn moves in, that sounds like a plan.
I've been told by many breeders that adult corns are able to be kept in 20L enclosures. Personally though I agree that that seems a bit too crampy. My 2 year old corn, Butters, is now in a 40 gal with two hides and a climbing branch. I think she appreciates being able to fully stretch out. About the feeding, I have always heard that it's recommended to feed them in a separate container so that they don't associate your hand coming in with their dinner. Otherwise they may start blindly striking any time you wish to handle them. I use a large Kritter Keeper for feeding, every Sunday. The new baby I got this weekend (her name will be either Bug or Scotch, I'm having trouble deciding; thoughts?) is in Butters' old 20L. I was kind of concerned about there being too much space as well, but we're seeing how it goes. There are two hides and a climbing stick here as well, and also a big rock just for filler. When I went to pick her up to feed her, she got very nervous and distraught, but I believe this to be new tank stress as opposed to too much space stress. I'm trying to leave her alone to adjust. Like I said though, we're seeing how it goes. I may downgrade her to a 10 gal; that's the size Butters grew up in first. I'm just concerned about the heating pad being too strong for that much smaller of a tank.
I would be careful keeping mice in a plastic bin. Depending on how high (or low) you place the air holes, they can chew through it very easily. Just make sure they can't reach anything with an edge they can start chewing or they'll be gone. Jeff
Bug? lol, your snake will end up with a complex. I can understand from a breeders point of view to keep enclosures small, given the space they would need. But if you only have 1 snake or maybe 2 then I just think they should be given more of a home. 20l as well, for an adult Corn, that seems well small. That's about 52 x 38 x 27cm. I've read somewhere that you need to give them a fairbit of room, because they only have 1 functional lung they need to stretch out once in a while to aid their respiratory systems. I suppose that's why they say teh enclosure should be the length and width = length of the snake.
I think it's cute. ;P I'm thinking it fits her... She's tiny and has big buggy eyes and all. The other name, Scotch, is just one to match Butters. Which is all right, but there's nothing specific to her in the name. You know? So I think Bug it is.
Well I should be ordering my Corn Snake setup up tomorrow night hopefully, if not then definitely this week. I was looking at the 888 Reptiles setup for £56.94 but with a few alterations. Exo Terra Large Flat Faunarium 46 x 30 x 17cm Komodo Heat Mat 7w 18 x 28cm Komodo Thermostat 300w Exo Terra Digital Thermometer (the strip thermometors to be removed) 1 x Exo Terra Hide (Already have a Sanke Cave so only need 1 more hide) 1 x Exo Terra Water Dish Medium (changed this from a small as I don't think a hatchling would be able to bether in the small one) 1kg Aspen Bedding You get the bedding but I reckon I will use paper towels. I sent an email to them asking for a new quote on it, although I have already sent one a few days ago with no reply , I'll also ask my local RC if they will consider a price match. Then all I have to do is wait until December to see what colour these hatchkings will be, or if I can't wait then get one sooner, lol.
